Fletcher: an Autism Assistance Dog

WE QUIT

To make a long story short...Yes we quit.

Here are some of the responces form the ClickSport list. Read on if you want. We will follow the advice of this list. I am using Competition Obedience: A Balancing Act by Judy Byron & Adele Yunck as well as continuning on with Sue Ailsby's Training Levels. We will see how it goes when we enter into the ring some time in the spring. Whatever happens though, we will both be having fun!

From: "Robin Nuttall"
Date: Wed Feb 9, 2005 1:11 pm
Subject: RE: [ClickSport] What to do?? (LONG)
What do I do? Fletch can go to the ring right now and probably get the CD with out much sweat...IF he had a handler that knew what to do in the ring.>>>>>RUN, do not walk, away from this so-called instructor. Hopefully you can find some other teachers in your area. I'd go observe classes they teach before even enrolling. Look for someone who is open to play, food, toys, and yes, clickers.
You made a mistake many people make--allowing an "authority figure" to override what you know is right for your dog. This teacher had no right to put a choke collar on your dog if you didn't want one. She had no right to pop your dog for no reason. She shouldn't have told you to not use a clicker, but it's her class. If she doesn't want a clicker, fine.I'd phone her and tell her that you have realized this is not the class for you. I'd tell her why, and I'd ask for at least a partial refund.
Then go out and find a better trainer.


From: Susan Ailsby
Date: Wed Feb 9, 2005 1:43 pm
Subject: Re: [ClickSport] What to do?? (LONG)

"the only reason I am in the class is to learn what to do I the ring...this class is for ME not the dog. "Yes, Dana, LOTS of people have had this happen to them. Since the class is for you and not for the dog, how about going to the class and NOT taking the dog.Another option would be to hire a private instructor to spend an hour once in a while to walk you through what you need to know about the ring and to evaluate your progress once in a while.Sue Eh?http://www.dragonflyllama.com/

From: Lorraine Andrusiak
Date: Wed Feb 9, 2005 2:33 pm
Subject: Re: [ClickSport] What to do?? (LONG)

You can also just go yourself to obedience trials and watch the competition you can learn a lot from watching the others in the ring.

cheers,Lorraine Andrusiak andAshley and Cosby Whippets British Columbia CANADA

From: Linda H
Date: Wed Feb 9, 2005 5:47 pm
Subject: Re: [ClickSport] What to do?? (LONG)

Be sure to get the obedience rule book from the AKC and read it thoroughly.Linda H

From: "Ellen Bloomfield"
Date: Wed Feb 9, 2005 3:06 pm
Subject: Re: [ClickSport] What to do?? (LONG)

> So on to my question, I would love to show him in obedience but I have no clue what to do or expect in the ring. >
To add to the excellent answers here is learn the rules. I don't know whatvenue you will be showing in, but AKC, UKC and ASCA all have the obedience rulesposted on their website.Learn them. Learn them. Learn them.

Ask questions of this list about the rules if you are confused. AKC clubs oftenoffers judges seminars that go over the technicalities of the rules.About a year ago I went and did a private lesson with someone who was recommendedto me by a friend. I went in there open minded and came out of there more convinced I didn't need a private instructor, especially if it was him. I just figured that his dogs learned despite him or that he trained his dogs much differently than he actually taught. I also spent about 2 months away from obedience training after that lesson to allow me and my dog to decompress :/ It was not good at all.About 6 months after this "lesson" we were in the obedience ring. Since then, this same dog who this person proclaimed "knows no basics" has qualified in 16 straight trials in novice, both the A classes and the B classes and AKC as well as UKC. Not bad for a dog who knows no basics.
--Ellen Bloomfield and the herding crew

From: "kim"
Date: Wed Feb 9, 2005 5:55 pm
Subject: Re: [ClickSport] What to do?? (LONG)
Get out of the class.IF the training isn’t willing to use a clicker, or at least let you use one, thenshe has no business instructing you.IN addition, NEVER let someone handle your dog if you don't feel comfortable. Ihave only allowed people to handle my dog THREE times, and two of them were toprove that he won't do it for someone else :) The third was a clicker trainerwho used him for a demo :) I know it is hard to say something, but if your dogdoesn’t work under certain conditions, stand up for him and say so. Bowie doesn’twork in a collar at all - I use no leash, or a harness on him. I CANNOT controlhis head - and that is something that we work up to -- he trials in a collar andwe do run troughs on a collar, but I train him on a harness.At this point you may need to go back to basics with Fletcher and work back upto regain trust.Find a clicker trainer locally. I train at THREE places (I can't reliably make classes at any one of them), and one uses clicker exclusively, the other is VERYreceptive, and the third is willing to let me use it on my own. ALL THREE traincompetition level obedience, agility, and a variety of other sports (rally,freestyle, etc).Personally, every single THING is a training tool. Does the trainer expect youto be able to do leash pops in the ring? A prong is a training tool. a Trainingcollar is a training tool. ANY COLLAR AT ALL is a training tool. rewarding withtug - training tool, rewarding with food? training tool!!! You can’t take ANY OFIT in the ring with you. Does that make people stop using them?
Use what works for your dog. and stand up for it.be proud you click! I used to be the people that didn’t understand it and lookeddown on it - now you cant take the clicker out of my hands!=kim

From: "kim"
Date: Wed Feb 9, 2005 5:56 pm
Subject: Re: [ClickSport] What to do?? (LONG)
Something I would suggest - a handling/attention course. Much is focused on howthe HANDLER does things, and many of them are VERY clicker friendly. The oneattention course was more help towards my dogs CD and competitive career thananything else.=Kim

To:ClickSport@yahoogroups.com
From: Click4Aussies@aol.com
Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 19:14:39 EST
Subject: Re: [ClickSport] What to do?? (LONG)
Been there, done that. :( You learned the hard way (as did I) never give your dog to anyone unless you know what they're going to do and approve of it.Where are you located Dana? Maybe we can help you hook up with someone. Barring that, get to a few obedience trials and watch the B rings. Don't be afraid to ask people to explain what's going on, or even hold up a sign "Newbie looking for help" If there is nobody else and you feel like you're going to have to train by yourself, a couple books will help. Competition Obedience: A Balancing Act by Adele Yunck and Judy Byron is excellent, and will help you lay foundation for moving up to open and utility. It's not a clicker book but is extremely clicker friendly, especially the way they break the exercises down. Before you go in the ring, get Barbara Handler's video and book set (both!) Successful Obedience Handling. For attention work you may want to invest in Teri Arnold or Dawn Jec. Here is a link to Dogwise with a lot of books. :D _Browse Dogwise.com_ (http://www.dogwise.com/Browse/SubCatList.cfm?SubCat=Competitive%20Obedience
Hope & the Shyraphic PackShy

To: "ClickSport" ClickSport@yahoogroups.com
From: "Margarat Nee - The Art Of Dog"
Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 16:14:00 –0800
Subject: Re: [ClickSport] What to do?? (LONG)

These are what I've found helpful in preparing *myself* for the ring:The book "Successful Obedience Handling: The NEW Best Foot Forward" gives great hints on how to help (not hurt) your dog's performance through good handling.Do a private lesson with someone with a good reputation of ring handling that is only about your handling. Make it clear that training issues are for you to deal with at home, that the lessons is for evaluating your handling and where you are as a team - troubleshooting, not training. The advantage of a private lesson is that it puts you in more control of the situation.Go to matches, lots of them. Nervousness can reek havoc on a performance.For instance, I found that one thing I have to work on is how I respond to the less-than-pleasant training techniques happening around us. I would just try to tune it out, but since my dog would too, the whole experience was a little negative, and I had trouble getting her "up" for the ring. So, if I were to pursue obedience again I would go to matches and not even go in the ring for a while, just play around the grounds.One thing I haven't done that may be helpful is use audio recordings that recreate the ring experience. I've seen them available at dogwise.com.Cheers,------------------ Margarat Neethe ART of DOGEncinitas, CA
http://theartofdog.com/

Posted by: Dana / Saturday, February 19, 2005

MONDAY, FEB. 217:00 a.m. ET
"Today" series on Autism begins. Early signs of the hidden epidemic and causes of Autism will be discussed.
TUESDAY, FEB. 227:00 a.m. ET
"Today" Autism series continues. What does a diagnosis for Autism entail? Dan Marino appears with his family to talk about his experiences with Autism. Chris
WEDNESDAY, FEB. 237:00 a.m. ET
"Today" series on Autism continues with talks about intervention and the emotional aspects of the disease.
THURSDAY, FEB. 247:00 a.m. ET
"Today's" series on Autism continues with how to advocate for your child.
FRIDAY, FEB. 257:00 a.m. ET
Today's" series on Autism wraps up with Bob and Suzanne Wright and the dangers of Autism in adults.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3032633/?ta=y

Some days it seems the only predictable thing about it is the unpredictability. The only consistent attribute, the inconsistency. There is little argument on any level but that autism is baffling, even to those who spend their lives around it.
http://www.southflorida.com/sfparenting/sfe-sfp-autism%2c0%2c6196233.story

I posted this email at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ClickSport/
Copying it here is easer that retyping it....

From: "Dana"
Date: Wed Feb 9, 2005 1:03 pm
Subject: What to do?? (LONG)

Hey all,
This is my first time posting to this list. I normally don’t have time to do much posting but I thought I needed to get some advice on a dilemma I am having.

A bit of background may be in order. Fletcher, my service dog, is a 'crossover dog' (he was trained on a choke collar). In my opinion, developed soon after I got him, he is quite a soft dog. In this I mean if I use a choke collar or any other physically manipulative methods in training he gets very stressed and shuts down. About 6 months after I got him, I removed the choke collar for good and now work him on a buckle collar.

As far as using a clicker goes, in the beginning it was rough.... he was hesitant to offer any behaviors at all (we worked on perfecting a sit stay here!! NO FOOT MOVEMENT AT ALL or turning of the head). It was as if he were stone. I got to the point where I decided to throw food and risk ruining the automatic 'don’t eat any food on the floor' behavior he came with. This got things rolling...he had to move to get food for sitting solid.

Any way.... clinkering is proceeding fabulous. He is much more animated and involved when working than he was when I got him.

So on to my question, I would love to show him in obedience but I have no clue what to do or expect in the ring. In order for me to understand what to do, I signed up for comp obedience classes. On the first night we came with clicker a few fantastic toys and a bitof yummy food. As people come in I realize all dogs have choke or pinch collars on. The instructor calls us all up for the start of class. We begin with heel. Fletch heels great but not looking up at me.... something I have just started to work on just for the ring. He looks up, I click and praise. The instructor says, "HALT!!! Who used a clicker?!" I told her I did. She then proceeded to tell me clickers were not being used in that class. I said ok and put the clicker down (fletch has a 'YES' verbal that does the same thing as the clicker). No problem.... just a bit more/different work for me but that is ok I guess. Later we take a break and she comes over to me and tells me "if I want to have him compete in the ring the clicker wont work. After all he is not working for me just the clicker and the toy/food". I told her that this argument really did not make sense because after all her dog was not working for her any more than it was avoiding the collar. She really did not like this...and I guess I can see why.

By the time the session was over Fletch had a collar on him with my thinking I just won’t use it. Well that is fine and dandy until she comes over and 'shows me how to use it'. 1 pop, 2 pop, 3 pop (Fletcher is shutting down and throwing stress signals) 4, 5, 6pop.... and more than that she is just standing there not telling him to do anything. I feel SO SO bad that I did not tell her to stop. (((DONT EVER HAND THE LEASH TO AN INSTRUCTOR THAT YOU DONT KNOW WELL))) I was livid.... Fletch was shaken up.... we both went home and slept.

What do I do? Fletch can go to the ring right now and probably get the CD with out much sweat...IF he had a handler that knew what to do in the ring.

Do I not go to class? Do I take a different dog that can handle these methods better? I just want to tell her that she is the instructor and I have the ability to pick and choose which methods I want to employ and the only reason I am in the class is to learn what to doI the ring...this class is for ME not the dog.

What would you do? Has any one ever had this happen?

Dana and Fletcher (4yo GR)

This is My buddy "Sam" the chinchilla. I love to sit and watch him and his friend "Jack" for hours!! 

Meds Reminder task 

It has been a while. Dana and I are back at Hope in the freezing cold enjoying our selves. Classes are going well so far. Dana is taking (and I am sleeping through) Comparative vertebrate anatomy, Behavior Disorders, and an advanced research class focusing on acculturation patterns of adolescent immigrants to the Holland area. All in all we do not have a bad schedule.

I posted 2 picture below. One is of one of my chinchilla friends "Sam" ( you can see "Jack" in the back ground). I love to sit in front of the cage at home and watch these guys for hours. In fact I like to watch most animals be it fish, rats, mice, frogs, lizards. You name it, I like it....well I don't actually like snakes much. They scare me. The other picture is one that Dana took when she was instead needing to tell me I was a good boy and give me a treat for reminding her to take her meds.

Well that is it for now. I dont really have a lot to say.

Stay warm.

So this morning Dana dragged me to the vets office......I have to say this time wasn't so bad though, no needles or anything! I have been very ichy, scrachy and bumpy for a few months now and nothing seems to be working. The vets keep thinking I have a Staph infection but after 4 rounds of medication and special shampoo it hasn't gone away!!! Today I saw an alergist and she suggested I have an allergy test done and swich my food to an alergin free diet specially made by Hills. We will try the new food first per suggestion of the vet for 12 weeks before moving to the alergy test. Hopefully this helps because I am not very comfortable.

Jon Katz wrote this on the CSDogBookReview List. How true this is! If I have learned one thing in my partnership with Fletcher is that trainig is not last for a segment of his life. We are always learning and growing together. I am constanly reading books on 'the psychology of dogs' ...well I have to end here I may finish this post later but it is still exam week.....

Dana

To: CSDogBookReview@yahoogroups.com
From: "jon_ktz"
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 22:41:44 -0000
Subject: [CSDogBookReview] Training and Consciousness

To me, training needs to be redefined. It isn't something you do in a three week class, or that you do at a mall pet store. It is a significant ethical responsibility and commitment to the dog, one which almost completely defines your relationship with the dog, and the dog's relationship with the world.

Posted by: Dana / Thursday, December 16, 2004

Sigh....I think I hate exams more than Dana does. Sleep, sleep, sleep...That is all I have done for the last few days. I guess, sure, I have been out to the pine grove every day this week for about 30 minutes at a time but still...Exams...blegh. I figure that we will spend 8 hours in the testing room....that is if Dana is quick on taking them, and she isnt. Monday we were in that boring, chalk dust filled room for 3.5 hrs.....way to long I say, way to long.

Friday, can you come any faster?

Fletcher

WE HAVE SNOW!!!
The first of the season!! This is SO exciting. This morning I played Kong with Dana and Belle.